Author Topic: helmet help  (Read 534 times)

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Offline farmer

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helmet help
« on: November 24, 2018, 05:15:58 pm »
hi all,  very recently i had a most unfortunate run in with a lightweight helmet..... i only then realised how much i needed one...
the helmet in question was an airoh gp500 ...awesomely light but no internal sun visor.
since i have been periodically searching the web for something similar.... so far a few options have cropped up.
shark spartan carbon , very strong contender
airoh 701 pure carbon , similar in pretty much every way to the shark
avg k3/5 looks good but heavier than the previous pair
x-lite   sorta ruled them out as i know nothing about them...(then i dont know alot about the others either but i have heard of them)
bell star    late comers as i have just found out about their transitions visor
any one any experience of the candidates or any other likely suspects?
i'd like to know about ...noise levels, sun visor (er um) technology,weight...and of course price...price might be better in big letters.
any comments helpful or otherwise gratefully accepted.

Offline Andym535

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #1 on: November 24, 2018, 05:56:32 pm »
X-lite is (or was) Nolan’s premium brand.
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Offline Andym535

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #2 on: November 24, 2018, 06:01:29 pm »
I think the SHARP rating gives some idea of how helmets perform in real world tests...
https://sharp.dft.gov.uk
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Offline raesewell

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #3 on: November 24, 2018, 07:09:51 pm »
I wouldn't go by Sharp ratings alone, they are not the be all and end all, although they are helpful. Some people have questioned their testing methods.

Offline Eyore

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #4 on: November 24, 2018, 08:51:59 pm »
Being something of a Imelda Marcos of helmets I have an Airoh GP500 which is ultra light, lovely to wear but leaks like a sieve  in heavy rain through the vents. I have an X Lite which is a lovely touring helmet, quiet, nice quality and has an internal sun visor which is great at this time of year. But like any woman with a love of favourite designer handbags , I always end up picking my Arai Chaser X which just fits like a glove on my Arai shaped head.
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Offline black-k1

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #5 on: November 24, 2018, 09:09:04 pm »
I wouldn't go by Sharp ratings alone, they are not the be all and end all, although they are helpful. Some people have questioned their testing methods.

The SHARP testing methods were, as I understand it, questioned by Arai when their helmets didn't do very well!!!!

There is no other independent testing available over and above the various mandatory requirements so it's the best out there.
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Offline raesewell

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2018, 09:14:10 pm »
Being something of a Imelda Marcos of helmets I have an Airoh GP500 which is ultra light, lovely to wear but leaks like a sieve  in heavy rain through the vents. I have an X Lite which is a lovely touring helmet, quiet, nice quality and has an internal sun visor which is great at this time of year. But like any woman with a love of favourite designer handbags , I always end up picking my Arai Chaser X which just fits like a glove on my Arai shaped head.
Hello Kim nice to see you posting again, where ya bin  ;D

Offline Eyore

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2018, 09:18:23 pm »
I wouldn't go by Sharp ratings alone, they are not the be all and end all, although they are helpful. Some people have questioned their testing methods.

The SHARP testing methods were, as I understand it, questioned by Arai when their helmets didn't do very well!!!!

There is no other independent testing available over and above the various mandatory requirements so it's the best out there.

Arais contention if I remember correctly was that a machine uniformly punching a helmet here and there in no way replicates real world random impacts.
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https://ultimatemotorcycling.com/2013/04/08/motorcycle-helmet-standards-explained-dot-ece-22-05-snell/
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Offline richtea

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #8 on: November 24, 2018, 10:30:13 pm »
I wouldn't go by Sharp ratings alone, they are not the be all and end all, although they are helpful. Some people have questioned their testing methods.

The SHARP testing methods were, as I understand it, questioned by Arai when their helmets didn't do very well!!!!

There is no other independent testing available over and above the various mandatory requirements so it's the best out there.

That write-up isn't about SHARP - they're DOT, ECE 22.05 & Snell, and some of those do tests involving sharp object impacts.
According to the 1990s COST (Cooperation in Scientific and Technical Research) 327 study, that isn't a very common occurence, hence why manufacturers (and users) doubt the usefulness of some of the tests.

SHARP claims to reproduce & measure more realistic situations, such as glancing blows.

There has been criticism of SHARP as well (here and here for example). The main criticisms seem to be that the test head used is not a 'soft' head like a real human, and that the rotation effects aren't measured (SHARP says otherwise).

However, for all that, as David says, no one has come up with anything better yet.

Some good advice from SHARP themselves:
Remember, the most important aspect of a helmet is that it provides the right fit for you. It’s not necessarily the highest SHARP rated helmet that will be the best for you if it doesn’t fit correctly. When you are choosing your next helmet, try on as many as you can to find a selection that fit and are comfortable and then consider their SHARP safety rating to make the safest possible choice.

Lastly, for amusement since I found it whilst searching just now, here's my helmet (well, not mine) as tested by Guy Martin - it's bust bottom left. Good of him to test it for me.

Offline Eyore

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #9 on: November 25, 2018, 07:48:59 am »
Hello Kim nice to see you posting again, where ya bin  ;D
Thanks Rae, just mad busy quitting jobs, setting up a new business,this and that. Hopefully able to concentrate on the important things like two wheels again now.
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Offline black-k1

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #10 on: November 25, 2018, 09:47:43 am »
I wouldn't go by Sharp ratings alone, they are not the be all and end all, although they are helpful. Some people have questioned their testing methods.

The SHARP testing methods were, as I understand it, questioned by Arai when their helmets didn't do very well!!!!

There is no other independent testing available over and above the various mandatory requirements so it's the best out there.

That write-up isn't about SHARP - they're DOT, ECE 22.05 & Snell, and some of those do tests involving sharp object impacts.
According to the 1990s COST (Cooperation in Scientific and Technical Research) 327 study, that isn't a very common occurence, hence why manufacturers (and users) doubt the usefulness of some of the tests.

SHARP claims to reproduce & measure more realistic situations, such as glancing blows.

There has been criticism of SHARP as well (here and here for example). The main criticisms seem to be that the test head used is not a 'soft' head like a real human, and that the rotation effects aren't measured (SHARP says otherwise).

However, for all that, as David says, no one has come up with anything better yet.

Some good advice from SHARP themselves:
Remember, the most important aspect of a helmet is that it provides the right fit for you. It’s not necessarily the highest SHARP rated helmet that will be the best for you if it doesn’t fit correctly. When you are choosing your next helmet, try on as many as you can to find a selection that fit and are comfortable and then consider their SHARP safety rating to make the safest possible choice.

Lastly, for amusement since I found it whilst searching just now, here's my helmet (well, not mine) as tested by Guy Martin - it's bust bottom left. Good of him to test it for me.

And this is always the problem when SHARP are mentioned. I have no idea if N. J. Mills in Birmingham has any "axe to grind" but the fact that Moto Legends, who make a profit from selling helmets and, I assume, make more profit from selling an expensive helmet, highlight that it was a cheap helmet that initially did well in the tests, suggests that their motives may be in question.

All helmets have to pass the pretty basic minimum requirements to get certification in the first place. Beyond that, the ONLY scientifically repeatable testing that enables differentiation between helmets is done by SHARP. It's not perfect and there are always ways that it can be improved but there is NO OTHER alternatives beyond "wet finger in the air" that a punter can use to suggest which helmet is better at doing the job that, very often, a large amount of money is paying for.

If I have a choice of two helmets that fit equally well, and have all the features I require, then I have no doubt, the number of SHARP stars will be a significant deciding factor.
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Offline Phmode

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #11 on: November 25, 2018, 11:41:26 am »
My Schuberth C3 is/was the quietest helmet available when I bought it. It is also very light (compared to what I have no idea  ::) ) and it has an easily operated, replaceable, internal sun-visor; when I say easily operated, I mean you can actually deploy it and retract it with a mere shrug of a shoulder and a twist of the head, no hands needed, as the lever is on the left side of the bottom rim, unlike some others where it is on the top of the helmet.

Mine has started to lose some of it's resilience in the internal padding and doesn't fit as snugly as it used to but back in the day it was cosy and warm at all times. The vents are good, it has a 'winter/summer' setting on the padding above the head and apart from the odd dribble of rain down the inside of the visor when used in the 'city' mode with the visor cracked open, it stays dry inside.

Not the cheapest but an excellent mid-range priced helmet with all the features including Pin-Lock visor.

Offline farmer

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #12 on: November 25, 2018, 12:58:39 pm »
thanks all, the c3 was a strong runner when i bought my last helmet, i went for a roof boxer instead which i am mostly happy with. there are draw backs though, fitting a scala g9 was a bit of a pain and the best/only position means i can only secure one of the two poppers securing the front of the helmet, it is a heavy helmet - though its only bothered me since i started "weight lifting" carbon helmets, and my biggest thing is the tinted visor, ok on an average sunny day and not to bad in the dark but nowhere near dark enough in a strong sun.
i would like a nice light quiet helmet for long runs ... the boxer is perfectly acceptable for short bursts.
good to hear the gp500 leaks a bit before i go mad and splash the cash!! wonder if the 701 is the same.
nobody experienced the transition visor yet ...sounds good but is it dark enough?
questions questions....

Offline Phmode

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #13 on: November 25, 2018, 03:44:20 pm »
My C3 visor is dark enough but I do have photochromic lenses in my spec and a 'sun visor' strip along the top of the outer visor so I can totally block low sun if I need to.

I have the Sena 20S fitted (glued) to the side of the C3 with no faceplate opening or sun visor mechanism problems.

Offline farmer

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Re: helmet help
« Reply #14 on: November 27, 2018, 12:23:41 pm »
c3 looks a great helmet but i want lightness...flip ups seem to need an extra bit of weight for the ,,, well flip up.
does your visor darken a lot as thats what intrested me in the bell helmet range... maybe a drop down would be best but the lightweight  bell helmets don't have that option.