Author Topic: Are you a Hendon shuffler?  (Read 464 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline TomL

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2384
  • Karma: +33/-4
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: K1300S
  • Location:: Hertfordshire
Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« on: March 29, 2018, 12:56:21 pm »
Following an article "The dark art of advanced riding" in Motorcycle Monthly it seems that IAM Masters are expected to stop using the Hendon shuffle. Not stopping using the Hendon shuffle was one of the reasons he failed when the author took his Master's test.

I was told by Giles Lamb, a Rapid Training and police instructor that all Kent police riders usually come to a stop using their front brake, and that the Hendon shuffle is old hat.

Since my rideout with Giles Lamb I have reverted to stopping using my front brake which I find much tidier.
As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everybody is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

Offline raesewell

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3488
  • Karma: +30/-3
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: Yamaha FJR (2013)
  • Location:: Normanton West Yorkshire
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #1 on: March 29, 2018, 01:25:07 pm »
I occasionally use the Hendon shuffle to see if I still remember how to do it  :D
« Last Edit: March 30, 2018, 08:27:01 pm by raesewell »

Offline Phmode

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7808
  • Karma: +64/-15
  • I am the evil webmaster, do not cross me!
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: BMW K1300S 2012
  • Modifications and add-ons:: Sargent Seat, Powerbronze Screen, Akrapovic Silencer, Ilmberger Hugger, K12S Black Top Yoke, Helibars, Cruise, Centre Stand, Sidestand Extender, Full 3M Film, Barkbusters Hand Guards in winter.
  • Location:: Ledbury, Herefordshire
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #2 on: March 29, 2018, 02:18:48 pm »
For those of us that can't even find their rear brake, I am afraid the Hendon Shuffle might as well be a Pasodoble.... ::)

Offline Belco100

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 325
  • Karma: +3/-0
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: K16GT & S1000XR
  • Location:: Essex
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #3 on: March 29, 2018, 02:23:01 pm »
It's not really to do with how you stop, its about covering you brakes when stationary and going into and out neutral - right foot down, left foot up, change into/out of gear, left foot down, right foot up to cover brake (hence the shuffle). It's a bit out of date with a lot of modern bikes, especially Ks with linked brakes (except ABS ones  :D). The front brake holds the back anyway. And bikes with the new Bosch ABS units hold the brakes on for you, a feature called Hill Start, which I use all the time on my K16GT and really miss when on the K13S  :-\. Brakes are on whenever I am not moving.

« Last Edit: March 29, 2018, 02:25:46 pm by Belco100 »

Offline Phmode

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7808
  • Karma: +64/-15
  • I am the evil webmaster, do not cross me!
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: BMW K1300S 2012
  • Modifications and add-ons:: Sargent Seat, Powerbronze Screen, Akrapovic Silencer, Ilmberger Hugger, K12S Black Top Yoke, Helibars, Cruise, Centre Stand, Sidestand Extender, Full 3M Film, Barkbusters Hand Guards in winter.
  • Location:: Ledbury, Herefordshire
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #4 on: March 29, 2018, 02:34:25 pm »
Why would anyone think it a good idea to have your foot on the brake pedal when stationary. I have a perfectly good hand control for that if needed but in 97% of cases, two feet on the ground is sufficient and is much safer.

The Hendon Shuffle was a case of some holier-than-thou riding instructor dreaming up stuff to make stopping look like a military drill manoeuvre and to catch out the inept among their students.

Discuss...

Offline drumwrecker

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 730
  • Karma: +6/-1
    • View Profile
    • Coombs Family Page
  • My K bike model:: K1300s 2009
  • Modifications and add-ons:: rear splash guard, Sargent seat and pod, 35mm bar risers
  • Location:: Welwyn Garden City
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2018, 02:52:13 pm »
Just had to look it up as I have never really known what it was, in fact I don't think I could tell you what I do as it is probably different for each situation.

Just found this description

The Hendon shuffle:
1 - stop the bike using both brakes 2 - place both feet on the floor (step 2 happens right after step 1...) 3 - lift left foot to put bike in to neutral, replace left foot on floor 4 - lift right foot and place it on the brake pedal
As taught at UK police training college in Hendon (& ignored by instructors the world over).
Its not always the destination that counts its the ride, having a destination just stops you going round in circles.

Offline richtea

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1374
  • Karma: +15/-1
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: Multi-coloured wonder
  • Location:: Banburyshire
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2018, 04:13:08 pm »

Why would anyone think it a good idea to have your foot on the brake pedal when stationary.


For control when rear-ended? That's happened to me twice. Hands free to steer, front wheel free to rotate, you might stay upright.
I managed to keep upright both times, but I can't guarantee it was the rear brake that helped, since I had my lucky underpants on too. Or are they unlucky? Hmm.

I quite like sitting in neutral and with the rear brake on when stationary, so I'm a partial shuffler. But I usually hit neutral just before coming to a halt - years of 'which-is-the-real-neutral' Laverdas taught me that trick.

Offline Phmode

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7808
  • Karma: +64/-15
  • I am the evil webmaster, do not cross me!
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: BMW K1300S 2012
  • Modifications and add-ons:: Sargent Seat, Powerbronze Screen, Akrapovic Silencer, Ilmberger Hugger, K12S Black Top Yoke, Helibars, Cruise, Centre Stand, Sidestand Extender, Full 3M Film, Barkbusters Hand Guards in winter.
  • Location:: Ledbury, Herefordshire
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2018, 09:58:30 pm »
That's why I hold it in gear at the lights unless I've filtered up the front; if there's only me I don't take my eyes off the rear-view...

Offline richtea

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1374
  • Karma: +15/-1
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: Multi-coloured wonder
  • Location:: Banburyshire
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2018, 10:19:28 pm »
That's why I hold it in gear at the lights unless I've filtered up the front; if there's only me I don't take my eyes off the rear-view...

Quite true - that would do the job too.

Offline nightrider

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 59
  • Karma: +1/-0
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: K1300 GT
  • Location:: Grantham
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2018, 12:37:14 am »
I just hold my bike with the front brake with the bike in neutral .
Ride your bike until it hurts-and then-err ride it a bit more.

Offline Eyore

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 348
  • Karma: +3/-0
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: K1200S
  • Modifications and add-ons:: Lots of Polish. Titax levers. GPR end can.R&G Protectors, carbon fibre bling, Tom Tom mount,daytime led lights.Low seat.Oberon clutch slave cylinder.Airblade DB screen,fender extender.Michael Dunlop sticker.
  • Location:: Co Clare
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #10 on: March 30, 2018, 09:40:19 am »
Load of old twaddle. Like most these days ,my left hoof is on the floor and ready to engage gear.
The fastest Pizza delivery bike in the west.

Offline Steve CH

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 58
  • Karma: +2/-0
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: 2012 K1300S
  • Location:: near Geneve
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #11 on: March 30, 2018, 09:54:43 am »
Under normal conditions no need to play about, I do however when doing a steep hill start two up, have it in gear and hold it on the rear brake. Fortunately I have long legs so propping it up with the left leg is no problem.

Steve
Some mistakes are too much fun to make only once

Offline Phmode

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7808
  • Karma: +64/-15
  • I am the evil webmaster, do not cross me!
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: BMW K1300S 2012
  • Modifications and add-ons:: Sargent Seat, Powerbronze Screen, Akrapovic Silencer, Ilmberger Hugger, K12S Black Top Yoke, Helibars, Cruise, Centre Stand, Sidestand Extender, Full 3M Film, Barkbusters Hand Guards in winter.
  • Location:: Ledbury, Herefordshire
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #12 on: March 30, 2018, 05:32:49 pm »
Tom, I think, posted up some great links to articles by Nigel a few weeks ago.

Now, far be it from me to tell Nigel how to ride  8) but if you 'fist' the throttle as he exhorts us to, then using the throttle and brake at the same time, e.g. when doing a hill start, is awkward to say the least.

I never fist the throttle, only ever use my ring and pinkie fingers on it so my first two fingers are used to being able to manipulate the front brake while the rest do the throttle; the biking equivalent of 'heeling and toe'ing' in a car and so hill starts are easy.

That's always been the most obvious way for me and another excuse not to find out where the back brake is  ::)

Offline TomL

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2384
  • Karma: +33/-4
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: K1300S
  • Location:: Hertfordshire
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #13 on: March 30, 2018, 05:37:28 pm »
Nigel???

I posted this article on another forum and this is how Giles Lamb responded.
This is a real key point in my book, and often comes up in the Rapid training days. And .... yeah ..... whilst it's not a grey area (clearly safety trumps anything else), there is a place in your bike riding for for a bit of style and panache.
We talk about the four S's, safety, system, smoothness, speed, and no where in that is 'Style'. But maybe there should be?! Maybe we should coin it the five S's ?! If everything is in place, and your riding is safe, systematic, smooth .... you get on with it .... then having a bit of style and flair is in my book a good thing.
I see riders who make such a cluster of coming to a stop. Bloody hell! it's just coming to a stop - its CBT stuff! But I still see people paddling, walking, hop skipping and jumping and ..... it looks shit! Even stopping with both feet down in my humble opinion, looks shit !!

Maybe its years of 'corporate riding' where from my part, you are a little bit on show, the public watch and they expect to see a good standard. And part of that is looking impeccable in traffic (filtering, town stuff etc) and the old swan on the water analogy.

I like to see riders glide to a stop at the junction, red light, whatever .... and when that foot goes down it should be like Rudolph Nureyev. Clean, crisp, heel rolling on to toe .... stop. Not even a hint of a skip. You control that bike beautifully, and you look, professional. If you're then jigging about swapping feet .... then the lights change and you're fannying about swapping feet again ...... nah ...... it looks pants and amateurish!

Both brakes to stop, off the rear in those last few feet as your foot comes down, left foot sorting out neutral and relaxing. Lights change ..... tap ..... go ......

As I have grown older, I've learned that pleasing everybody is impossible, but pissing everyone off is a piece of cake.

Offline Phmode

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7808
  • Karma: +64/-15
  • I am the evil webmaster, do not cross me!
    • View Profile
  • My K bike model:: BMW K1300S 2012
  • Modifications and add-ons:: Sargent Seat, Powerbronze Screen, Akrapovic Silencer, Ilmberger Hugger, K12S Black Top Yoke, Helibars, Cruise, Centre Stand, Sidestand Extender, Full 3M Film, Barkbusters Hand Guards in winter.
  • Location:: Ledbury, Herefordshire
Re: Are you a Hendon shuffler?
« Reply #14 on: March 30, 2018, 05:44:04 pm »
Nigel? Giles?. So close but no cigar...