2008 K1200GT

[TomL]

With luck if you got the old chain out without removing the sump then the new one should go back. After you have tensoned it the BMW way can you measure the slack in the chain. I read somewhere that someone reckoned that it should be 8mm. Sounds a lot to me.

[Costas]

There is no slack at all, nothing not even 1mm. Be very carefull nto to turn the sprocket the oposite way make ubsolutely certain for it.

[TomL]

I appreciate that there is no slack at all when setting up the chain tension using the BMW tools.

What I would like to know is how much slack should be left in the chain if the tension was set up without the BMW tools, if you understand what I mean.

[Costas]

Ok had to call him at home , no issues he's is babysitting , so the answer is 0,4cm .

[tmccusker]

Costas, TomL - Thanks for the input - valuble

TomL - you would think, but slipping that chain back down past the sprocket nut (easy) and onto the sprocket (impossible) turns into one of these chinese puzzles where things have to lined up, move exactly, twist, turned  etc. I spent at least 4-5yrs attempting - I have long slender fingers and relatively smail hands - I could get the fingers down past the sprocket bolt, but that was the end of it.
So Friday evening it was off with the manifold, sump - the only hitch was trying to unplug the Oxy sensor and the sump residual oil/ gunk. Looking back, 15mins to get the sump off and a bit of clean up is much easier - I'll see how that manifold goes back on and how many oil leaks we get from disturbing the sump. The chain went on immediately it was out of the way. This also gives the opportunity to clean up 9yrs of sump gunge - no doubt most of it from clutch dust.

Ok had to call him at home , no issues he's is babysitting , so the answer is 0,4cm .

I had actually installed the chain on Friday and had the clutch cage/ basket installed, but the oil chain tension was bothering me a bit - but that's the proper tool and the official procedure therefore it must be right ........ but I note that they don't provide a qualitative figure to check against.   

When following the procedure in RepROM, the chain slack with ECCENTRIC GAUGE tool in place was around 6mm, with the tool removed and the collar back in place this gave slack of  9mm - obviously too slack - you can tell just by feeling the amount of slack.

I checked the eccentricity of the tool, this gave the material thickness of the tool at the said mark as 5.7mm, and the opposite side material thickness of 5.5mm - I suspect these the 0.2mm offset provided by the tool (if I do the math - which I won't) will not give the necessary setting.

So Costas, your 4mm figure confirmed the concerns and I took the clutch and stuff back off this evening and reset it by feel and whoa and behold it was around 4-6mm when finished.

So oil chain completed, timing chain with all its anti-jump devices fitted and clutch installed. I'm using a Barnett clutch. Interestingly they have one of the tabs on each friction plates notched on their edges to align and insert into the proper orientation into the cage - there is one complexity which I didn't see in their literature - the notches are biased to one side of the tab - unless this biased side is place on the CCW side of the pack, the clutch basket will not fit into the assigned clutch cage position.

I'll try and get this all wrapped up Sunday/ Monday - I can maybe post some of the pictures  of the various failures and repairs - particularly the transmission changes. I need to get this thing back on the road  before the heat is turned up and enjoy our winter/ spring conditions.

Thanks Again - Tom

[TomL]

Costas, TomL - Thanks for the input - valuble

TomL - you would think, but slipping that chain back down past the sprocket nut (easy) and onto the sprocket (impossible) turns into one of these chinese puzzles where things have to lined up, move exactly, twist, turned  etc. I spent at least 4-5yrs attempting - I have long slender fingers and relatively smail hands - I could get the fingers down past the sprocket bolt, but that was the end of it.

You are patient Tom. I would have given up after half an hour but 4-5 years is a heck of a long time.

[tmccusker]

Hmm - I don't think I can even blame spellchecker for that one!! Good pick up, obviously hrs! - T

[Phmode]

I think I liked the commitment of many years spent trying; too many folks give up as soon as panel screws need to be removed 

Brian (who spent 23 years trying to get his Honda CBR1000F-H to idle properly  )

[Costas]

When yu have the time pics fm the Barnet installement would be much appreciated.
(Personally have e set in storage to be used when needed).

[tmccusker]

When yu have the time pics fm the Barnet installement would be much appreciated.
(Personally have e set in storage to be used when needed).

Costas
I'm having real difficulty trying to upload a photo to the site - I've a icloud account which is supposed to accommodate - but haven't figured it out. I see the icon on the "post reply" screen, but this is only to upload a url or similar link.

The picture is of the clutch pack, installed but not yet torqued down (for those who will note the top tab position wrt to cage!). You will see that the table notches are on the CCW of the circumference. I found that attempting to install them reversed (e.g. notch on the CW side) the pack would interfere with the cage. If this is correct (and I have been proven wrong many time e.g. lots of experience) this indicates that Barnett want the friction pads positioned in a certain way. I did a quick check with the caliper on the pad thicknesses and look for any difference on the out friction pad rings vs inner's and did not fin any notable differences. I haven't followed up with Barnett and haven't spent any more time looking to explain - I was aware that having spent yrs on trying to get the oil chain fitted without sump removal, that I should just get on with it and get riding again!!)

If you wish the picture, let me know and I'll send a PM. If I can figure out how the photo upload works I'll send it.
I'll try to load others showing the reason for the work - 2nd gear selector fork failure etc. I somehow seem to have lost on my iphone a bunch of photos of the re-machined engagement dogs to help overcome the problem again.

Tom

[raesewell]

http://www.eurokclub.bike/index.php/topic,63.0.html

Take a look here Tom

[tmccusker]

Thanks Rae
I've tried to follow that earlier, I think the problem may well lie with my understanding (or lack of it !!) of the Apple iCloud site - I'll sit down with a cuppa later today and try to figure it out.
Maybe my 6yr old nephew will help!!! - Tom

[Phmode]

Hi Tom,

I'm not sure the iCloud nonesense is designed for the same stuff as e.g. Photobucket.

Either way, the Google account is free to use if you have theinclination.

I use a totally free Photobucket account, have had tons of stuff in there for five years nad it is not even 10% full.

Is anyone else in here using iCloud and could help Tom?

[tmccusker]

Hi Guys
Rae et al, I will get off the iCloud nonsense and post some pictures - I seemed to have lost some, likely throuugh technical incompetence with the new iPhone - always bee a BlackBerry guy.

Been a busy week with the rebuild - and as you would expect there were some unexpected issues........ and on top of the bike I've now got the Merc up on the ramp and tractor not wanting to tractor for me, hence the slight delay in updating the post  - I'm sure we will all evolve with several arms, legs heads etc to allow multi tasking to happen  in a realistic time periods!

Back to the beemer - I was struggling to get decent moly paste for the final drive, so I reckoned it was fine to move ahead and finish off everything else - which went well. Start up went well, a small oil drip from the cam cover gasket forced a cooling system drainage, secondary are system pipe removal and some adjustments to the gasket (like 1mm on the rhs corner). On reassembly, that secondary air pipe seemed a limp to me, and after a slight tug the hose came away in my hand - SO, off with the fuel tank & header tank to figure out where it actually goes - after a couple of hours eventually found the dam SLS valve hose nozzle and it was obvious that the hose hadn't been connected for a long time (oily debris around the area). Also noted that the charcoal filter was not connected correctly and the fuel tank quick connect was weeping (which turned into a spray upon clean the debris up - and yes an interesting fuel minutes as the bike was still warm and the thing is position right above the exhaust headers). So on with the hose to the SLS, snip out the charcoal filter (no emissions tests on bikes in my county - I hope), a new quick connect and all back together  - whoa and behold on start up all the crappy idling issues were gone and the engine ran real well - lesson learnt. Silly EPA crap.

Without the final drive connected (need that paste) the new clutch, transmission chains, etc. were running like a new bike, oil leak gone and hopes of a weekend ride now in the works.

Finally got the paste and final drive was installed. Bike was started up in neutral, and at idle speed I ran up through the 6 gears. As I went up every gear, there was an increasing amount of racket ("a bag of bolts" as I would say to the fitters) to the point I shut it down and pondered. It ran so well without the engagement of the final drive. I pulled the clutch case off to check for any foreign debris but none - even had a magnetic probe down the cranckshaft wells looking for a loose bolt or similar but none (thank goodness!).

So the tranny and  the clutch did not like to run together in gear - I think this may come down to a couple of clutch issues (which seem to have been documented on K sites else ewhere :
- New clutch assemble needs to be re-balanced (longshot and I doubt it would give that amount of clatter, but probably not a bad thing to do)
- clutch basket springs which are very loose need to be replaced - more likely as  when the final drive speed increased, and given no load on the wheels, the whole drive system was likely clattering back and forth on the springs.

Still not worth a $1000 for a new basket, and I see there are a number of articles out there on K12/13 spring change out - I'm now debating what way to go.

I still have the cover off, clutch out, it's only a half hour job to get it all back in - so maybe the next move is to stop the shop testing and get it on the road and under load (ensuring I have the tow vehicle lined up and ready!!)

Any thoughts before I head off? - Cheers guys - Tom

[Phmode]

So Tom, the clatter was definitely only with it in gear and running the gearbox, yes! If so, then definitely not a camchain issue which under the circumstances is a huge relief.

I don't know if you are aware but the 'wet clutch' design on the K is really only a damp-clutch. The oil feed to the clutch only occurs when the clutch lever is pulled in.

In a true wet-clutch system the plates run in a bath of oil. Not so in a K.

So, having had the clutch apart, one wonders if the rattle is merely from insufficient lube on the plates in the initial runs. Just a thought.

Having re-read your report I see it was quiet until you fitted the final drive so forget the clutch stuff.

I seem to remember when I ran the K12 up through the gears on the stand it did make one hell of a racket, probably back-lash in the system which isn't noticeable on the road.

Brian