EuroKClub
Welcome to the BMW K1200 K1300 K1600 Forum => Who's Who? => I'll show you mine if you show me yours! => Topic started by: revd on September 02, 2020, 11:04:37 am
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Right here is my new to me K1200R with 26K on the clocks, ESA, ABS, heated grips, tank bag and handle bar guards.
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Admin Mode: Just sorted one uncontrolled width tag.
That looks lovely! Ah and that headlight isn't that far away from mine is it.
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Some updates. Rubbed down flaky paint and covered it with enamel gloss. Stripped, cleaned and greased the lower suspension bits. Stripped and painted the petrol cap surround as it was flaking off and looked horrible.
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Adding BoosterPlug and Delkevic baseline exhaust, simple stainless round one. Baffle stays in.
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BoosterPlug? Does it do anything?
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Waiting for it to arrive. Was £40 off Ebay, bought not used as sold bike. Previous owner used for 2 months, sold bike. I've bought it because it is a small sum and might make the bike a touch smoother on the lower revs. Not a huge issue, but every little helps and all that.
A little change to the bike is the exhaust.
(https://r3qpgg.am.files.1drv.com/y4mT70_2dANintclbCp4-TxxUrNhfS1fXCu6meGTrboHOZJ1ftFKHVK_t8dG4WMbPPebgxSdPSgPFzXaZ9o0D511eC8eVOSw28N25mKlsEr9puLZru70oTmpVBrHXugm_-ONpCb6-pbmvJIFEqs6QJpJtQ6EU--id5rKJHong5UujhEWXYxA2zu8QFyh-NDtJNa6Zk6VQ2sqfDxkNruIqfqLA?width=3456&height=4608&cropmode=none)
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Exhaust looks good.
Are you running on 99RON fuel? If not, I'd suggest giving it a go. I found it significantly improved low revs running such that I could happily run my bike down below 30mph in top and it would trundle along without complaint then pull strongly and cleanly when I opened the throttle. I also found that there was an mpg improvement that pretty much covered the increase in cost.
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yes. It is available 4 miles from me and I've been running it on higher octane from day one. No point not to really with this sort of engine! My old Daytona 900 loved the VMax stuff as well. Bike pulls well from 30mph in top gear. Love the torque and grunt.
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Tangent Time!
I always ran my K on the good stuff, but i've been running the GS on the normo stuff. Hardly even thought about it, but maybe i'll try going back to the good stuff and see if I discern much difference. Maybe it's all the round the world stuff I see where they put goat blood and all sorts into boxers and they carry on.
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My 1100s loves Avgas but my pocket doesn’t :) :(
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I think the booster plug (all variations) works well at fooling the ECU into doing something unwanted and fooling the rider into thinking it is doing something wonderful.
Decades ago I tried one on an Astra GTE MkII which had some interesting fuelling 'issues'. Did nothing. It was simply a cheap resistor, 34p a handful from The Shop On the Bridge or 50p from Maplin... :(
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The way the Booster Plug works is fool the ECU into thinking it’s colder that it really is,so the ECU chucks more fuel into the motor, it will certainly do something but a really blunt instrument.
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I did a lot, probably too much, reading and investigation on the Booster plug and the AF-Xied.
If you have a spare afternoon, follow the rabbit hole that is Roger 04 RT, the developer of the AF- Xied.
https://www.ukgser.com/forums/showthread.php/482858-AF-XIED-for-R1200-LC
Basically, the Booster plug fools the ecu initially in thinking it is colder than it is, and therefore dumps more fuel in. It plugs into the temperature sensor feed. The BMW ecu, using the other sensors including the o2 sensor, adjusts for the booster plug and it reverts to standard.
The Af-xied adjusts the o2 sensors reading to increase fuelling in closed-loop operation, and by learning, open loop operation after a few tanks of petrol. It is also adjustable depending on what aftermarket goodies, e.g. exhaust of air filter you have installed.
I've installed the AF-xied on a couple of bikes, including my current one and the result is noticeable and sustainable. But don't take my word for it, have a read of the link and search for all the discussions and data on it.
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10 years ago any kind of piggy back after market fuelling gizmo was dead, because so many folks had worked out how to access the the ECU, including the ream upon ream posted about about Hilltop I went in person and walked out after 20 minutes but that really is another story.
Because of the easy ECU access and how things were going I went with a Rexxer map and several hours on a dyno, it’s good but doesn’t have the ‘Feel of a PC’.
Within a couple years Europe along with the TUV had a major clampdown and ECU’s are all but impossible to break into and hence the comeback of piggyback, the two current front runners are Power Commander and Rapid Bike, my personal preference is a PC, currently have such on 3 bikes(2 PC111 and 1 PCV)and have another to go on my KTM over the winter.
Aftermarket fuelling is just like anything else in this life you get what you pay for and cheaper options are available.
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I agree Chris, Power commander is the gold standard. But it requires effort, and possibly a dyno to get the mapping etc. right.
The thing I like about the Af-xied is that it's a reasonable cost (around £200) and it's plug and play. I just wanted to iron out the stumbling below 4000 revs, and the hesitation. I didn't need any more power.
This gave it to me job done.
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10 years ago any kind of piggy back after market fuelling gizmo was dead, because so many folks had worked out how to access the the ECU, including the ream upon ream posted about about Hilltop I went in person and walked out after 20 minutes but that really is another story.
Because of the easy ECU access and how things were going I went with a Rexxer map and several hours on a dyno, it’s good but doesn’t have the ‘Feel of a PC’.
Within a couple years Europe along with the TUV had a major clampdown and ECU’s are all but impossible to break into and hence the comeback of piggyback, the two current front runners are Power Commander and Rapid Bike, my personal preference is a PC, currently have such on 3 bikes(2 PC111 and 1 PCV)and have another to go on my KTM over the winter.
Aftermarket fuelling is just like anything else in this life you get what you pay for and cheaper options are available.
I'm not sure I agree with the comment "ECU’s are all but impossible to break into". A small sample, I know, but the H2 SX is well known for being able to re-flash. Doing so adds around 40bhp with just the addition of a high flow filter and a decent can. Add in a de-cat and some new headers with the associated re-flash and you'll be adding over 50bhp from stock.
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So what’s your personnel experience of having an ECU remapped?
And who did it?
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On my H2 SX I had Hilltop remap my ECU. I gained about 10% more in the mid range and about another 5 bhp at the top end, up from192 bhp to 197bhp. I have the dyno charts somewhere and my "seat of the pants" dyno really noticed the difference.
I then discovered that Kawasaki neutered the H2 SX above 9000 rpm. Even though the throttle is held fully open, the ECU starts to shut the throttle butterflies so that at 11,000 the engine is only getting about 20% throttle. The red line is 12,500 rpm. Hilltop wouldn't remove this restriction so I sent my ECU to Florida as there was a very highly recommended tuner there. He flashed my ECU to remove the restrictions, and also change the 3 modes.
The original modes gave the same bottom end but neutered the top end above 6000rpm in low to give 100bhp, 8000rpm in medium to give 150bhp and full power high
The new modes all gave full, un-neutered throttle across the whole range but with a much gentler delivery and tuned for fuel economy in low, tuned for power rather than economy with a slightly gentler delivery in medium and "balls out", smack you in the face, raw grunt in high mode. I think high is actually too much for general road use. Just a wiff of throttle and the bike is off like a scalded cat. Great for track work or if you really want to go for it, but a little too much for general riding in traffic. On the road, I normally ride in medium which actually has the same "headline" dyno output (219bhp) as high
As you can see, very much a total reprogramme of the ECU.
ETA correction of mistype of final bhp value
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Only got as far as HT Brrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
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Been for a ride with the BoosterPlug fitted, and new exhaust.
Smoother straight off. No hesitation or missing. Does make a difference on that side of things for sure. I am going to stick with it for a while and see if the ECU works it way around it.
New exhaust sounds a lot nicer, deeper, with a rather lovely howl at higher revs. It feels smoother on and off the throttlle and I am looking forward to seeing what it is like on a longer ride. it is not too loud and I am leaving the baffle in. More road presence, but not obnoxious.
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It should be making a difference, no matter which mod you go for it’s all about filling the holes in the fuel map particularly around 4250 revs because that is where the TUV do their test, manufacturers know that even before submitting a bike for the test, and the way to stop emissions is too stop fuel going into the motor so that is what they do, all any of the mods do some being more sophisticated than others is put that fuel back in.
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On my H2 SX I had Hilltop remap my ECU. I gained about 10% more in the mid range and about another 5 bhp at the top end, up from192 bhp to 197bhp. I have the dyno charts somewhere and my "seat of the pants" dyno really noticed the difference.
I then discovered that Kawasaki neutered the H2 SX above 9000 rpm. Even though the throttle is held fully open, the ECU starts to shut the throttle butterflies so that at 11,000 the engine is only getting about 20% throttle. The red line is 12,500 rpm. Hilltop wouldn't remove this restriction so I sent my ECU to Florida as there was a very highly recommended tuner there. He flashed my ECU to remove the restrictions, and also change the 3 modes.
The original modes gave the same bottom end but neutered the top end above 6000rpm in low to give 100bhp, 900rpm in medium to give 150bhp and full power high
The new modes all gave full, un-neutered throttle across the whole range but with a much gentler delivery and tuned for fuel economy in low, tuned for power rather than economy with a slightly gentler delivery in medium and "balls out", smack you in the face, raw grunt in high mode. I think high is actually too much for general road use. Just a wiff of throttle and the bike is off like a scalded cat. Great for track work or if you really want to go for it, but a little too much for general riding in traffic. On the road, I normally ride in medium which actually has the same "headline" dyno output (119bhp) as high
As you can see, very much a total reprogramme of the ECU.
That's pretty mad, the restrictions! Is there a widely held view regarding why? Also I want one.
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That's pretty mad, the restrictions! Is there a widely held view regarding why? Also I want one.
No definitive answer but the suggestion is that it's neutered to keep the output below that of the H2 sports bike.
I think that bike manufactures view it as "bad form" to have a sports tourer model even close to the output of the "equivalent" sports model, let alone bettering it.
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Did anyone ask the sport end of the sport-tourer community?
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10 years ago any kind of piggy back after market fuelling gizmo was dead, because so many folks had worked out how to access the the ECU, including the ream upon ream posted about about Hilltop I went in person and walked out after 20 minutes but that really is another story.
Because of the easy ECU access and how things were going I went with a Rexxer map and several hours on a dyno, it’s good but doesn’t have the ‘Feel of a PC’.
Within a couple years Europe along with the TUV had a major clampdown and ECU’s are all but impossible to break into and hence the comeback of piggyback, the two current front runners are Power Commander and Rapid Bike, my personal preference is a PC, currently have such on 3 bikes(2 PC111 and 1 PCV)and have another to go on my KTM over the winter.
Aftermarket fuelling is just like anything else in this life you get what you pay for and cheaper options are available.
Sorry Chris but as per the other thread, my experience suggests that current ECUs are still very much get-at-able.
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I think it depends on the marque.
Both BSD and Hilltop said they couldn't crack my 22017 Honda ECU and it was tthe same from all those I spoke to.
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Added a K&N Airfilter this evening, I was bored... and it came up at a cracking good price, so could not ignore the fun of fitting it. Bike is on the battery tender on "frost" setting, so is ready to roar into life as and when I require it! Just not while it is wet and grim. Cold weather is fine, but cold wet weather is not!
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It all depends on where you live.
Back in my Thames Valley days, autumn was a good time to ride. No salt yet, not too hot in the full gear and there were few trees shedding their leaves so not much in the way of slime and emulsion on the roads. Oh, and no one had invented agriculture so there was tarmac on both sides of the road rather just on the opposite side to the side I was riding on...
Now I am in the Welsh Marches! Leaves, slime, emulsion, mud. And that is just the 2 miles into town...
Going the other way from home it is mud, emulsion, slime and then leaves on top.
Makes a change and the car doesn't care. As it happens, neither does the Honda ;)
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Motobatt Fitted. Alarum removed and sold on Ebay quickly enough. Bike is going very well and I will look at getting it booked in for a service in March. Will probably do final drive oil service myself just because I reckon I can and it will be a good learning curve for me. I am going to plug in the heater first and get the garage a tad warmer when I get around to doing it.
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On the garage front, I just stumped up for a dehumidifier for mine as it was up at 80%rh last week. Got it down to 50 or 60 depending on the setting, but has also warmed it up nicely.
I mention as warm air carries more moisture, so if you just heat it, and it's single brick like mine, it might rust your tools quicker!
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Motobatt Fitted. Alarum removed and sold on Ebay quickly enough. Bike is going very well and I will look at getting it booked in for a service in March. Will probably do final drive oil service myself just because I reckon I can and it will be a good learning curve for me. I am going to plug in the heater first and get the garage a tad warmer when I get around to doing it.
And when you get the service done, see if they will let you watch, (depending on the size of the operation I assume).
And hte next service can be done yourself. Changing the oil and filter is pretty easy, and there are a load of youtube videos. Same with air filter if needed. Brakes a bit more of a faf, but still do-able. They need little else for a standard service. I'd only bring mine into get valves done, everything else is pretty straightforwards.
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Nothing wrong with home servicing until you come to sell the bike when a FDSH is a very big selling point.
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For the age of the bike, home servicing does 90% of the job. Valves and brake fluid flush are specialist jobs that I do not have the tools for or inclination TBH. I'm not hooked on the FDSH thing, if the bike has been looked after it is apparent. I've home serviced the majority of my bikes and every person who has come to buy them when I've passed them on has been more than happy with the standard and the attention to detail.
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Have they been BMWs?
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Have they been BMWs?
This is my first BMW. All the others have been Honda, Triumph, Yamaha, Suzuki or even a Peugeot scooter (urghhh).
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Because of the bad press BMWs have had, potential buyers are very keen to have a FDSH, more so than other makes. Just sayin'
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When I traded up to my K13, my 2004 K12 with 40,000 miles went for top dollars to a guy who was prepared to pay for it and have it collected by a courier, all based on photos and the FBMWSH. He said it was the history that swung it for him.
A FBMWSH is no guarantee of anything other than a dedicated owner with more money than some. But it is worth its weight in reassurance to lots of buyers.
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Always found when buying bikes a full service history only ever tells half the story, from my experience normally means serviced as per and a bucket of water over it on a Sunday.
My preference has always been a combo of some where in between,receipts for oil/filters go a long way and gut instinct covers the rest.
The last bike I sold was twenty years ago, that most certainly didn’t have a full service history...the problem I had two buyers turned up at the same time and when they realised that the bike didn’t have a full history but the owner was OCD it nearly turned into a fight because it suddenly dawned on them it was a chance in a lifetime,the guy who didn’t ride during the winter got it, and as and when I ever sell any of the others I have the same applies.
Spent yesterday cleaning the K with a pointed sash brush and silicone yesterday clean??? Like the day it came out of the crate but it doesn’t have a stamped up book ::) ;D
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As an arbitrator I ask this:
I buy either bike, fbmwsh or fccsh take them both home. What is the process to get them both under warranty? The fbmwsh I assume I do it online the end. The fccsh do I need to get it serviced by BMW first?
To be Frank Spencer (hah apt actually) it looks like as with cars, more and more people (younger people obviously) buy vehicles as white goods and/or have less mechanical knowhow than the previous generations. Because abstraction. And credit. Stupid bloody credit.
My point is if we can just keep smiling for a few more years these types of topics will never appear again :p. Instead expect "what is an alternator?" "how do I pump up the tyres?" "my robot servant ran off with my wife, does this mean I can get another bike?"
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"my robot servant ran off with my wife, does this mean I can get another bike?"
More importantly 'who is going to do the servanting around here?'
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Dropped the K1200R off for servicing this morning. Was loaned a nice 02 GS1150 for the ride home. It is very comfortable and easy to ride, but my word does it feel vibey after being on the smooth IL4.... My hands are tingling after a 35 mile ride. Hopefully I will collect the bike this afternoon or tomorrow morning. Either works well for me.
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I have said this a few times before, I just can't find the love for a Boxer engine I'm a multi cylinder lover :winkthumbs:
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It's always nice to get back on your own bike, even after just half a day on a loaner.
Ks are pretty solid and by today's 'adventure' bike standards they're pleasantly compact - no excess gubbins. That's the bit that always surprises and pleases me.
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I’ve had my 1100s 22 years, stock it ain’t well loved it is, and if you don’t do the latter heaven help....fresh plugs and most importantly balance the injectors which frankly boarders on an art form, so if you have loaned the company dog.....yep i’ve been there with a unloved boxer.
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When I first got back on my K after a GS loaner, it felt like my head was on a level lower than my behind. Two minutes later I was smiling, Ks are superb.
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It was quite common for the dealer to give me a GS when my K's were being serviced. I never bonded with the GS. Compared to the K they felt tall and heavy with a complete lack of power. There was no "excitement" when riding them in the way there was with the K. Where the K felt like a wolf in sheeps clothing the GS always felt like a sheep in sheeps clothing.
As said by Andy, after the loaner GS, the K always felt like my ares was in the air, at least for the first couple of miles. The K also felt "tiny" after the GS, which, in reality, was something it never actually was.
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I never had a GS as a courtesy bike, even with the number of trips I used to make to the dealer! This was because I'd say "woah, no flipping tall ass bikes with these legs remember!"
Thus I was at a disadvantage when I finally got to ride one :P. That's my excuse anyway. Someone is going to have to put their wallet in my hands and let me back on a K at the Wrinklies this year to see if I feel like I used to when getting back on the K!
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Agreed with the above! I got back onto my tiny little K and felt it was a proper race bike, arse in the air and sky high redline. I went howling down the street and had to roll off quickly and behave! Loved being back on it and had a short journey home. What a cracking lovely bike to ride and it is relaxing to pootle along in sixth at 60mph knowing that I just have to flick the throttle to be in 3 figure speed before you can take your next breath. Brakes were flushed, new fluid, all calipers stripped and cleaned, fluids and filters all done. K&N cleaned. Worth spending the money and it makes me feel better knowing it is all sorted. MOT for the bike next Friday and all sorted for another year of fun riding.
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SWMotech Plate and adapter plate fitted. Used spacers to get a nice height. Now on the lookout for a nice Givi topbox to finish off the job. Gave the last one I had away, but it was a bit battered, so just as well!
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A top box? The devils work!
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I never had a GS as a courtesy bike, even with the number of trips I used to make to the dealer! This was because I'd say "woah, no flipping tall ass bikes with these legs remember!"
Thus I was at a disadvantage when I finally got to ride one :P. That's my excuse anyway. Someone is going to have to put their wallet in my hands and let me back on a K at the Wrinklies this year to see if I feel like I used to when getting back on the K!
Well Matt what do you think about getting back on a K now after riding the GS with the Ks over the hills and around Wales. 8) ;D
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You know what Tom, I'm going to say I'm happy to stick with the GS!
I felt much happier and less tired at the end of each day than previous years. Though we did have a different mix of roads, but definitely I felt more confident on all types, from the fast stuff to the gravel and craters parts of Monday.
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SWMotech Plate and adapter plate fitted. Used spacers to get a nice height. Now on the lookout for a nice Givi topbox to finish off the job. Gave the last one I had away, but it was a bit battered, so just as well!
How do you use spacers with the three 1/4 turn fasteners on the adaptor plate Gordon?
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SWMotech Plate and adapter plate fitted. Used spacers to get a nice height. Now on the lookout for a nice Givi topbox to finish off the job. Gave the last one I had away, but it was a bit battered, so just as well!
How do you use spacers with the three 1/4 turn fasteners on the adaptor plate Gordon?
Spacers are under the SWMotech plate which is on the grab handle of the bike. Spacers lift this up a bit. The Givi adaptor plate goes straight onto the SWMotech plate, so no worries there.
Topboxes are a necessary evil in being able to lock up helmet and gloves and boots. I can pack my shoes, robes and stoles if I am taking a service elsewhere and it is waterproof too! Win win.
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I can pack my shoes, robes and stoles if I am taking a service elsewhere and it is waterproof too!
I think we can definitely save that one in top 10 list of 'What do I use my topbox for?'.
At number 1.
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I have someone coming to view the bike tomorrow.... it may have a new home soon. Not because there is anything wrong with it, it is superb and great fun to ride. I've only done 1187 miles in 14 months! The least in all my years of riding. I'm looking to change to something a bit more sedate, with a different character. May well be a BMW still, perhaps a nice R1200R will tick the box!
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Bike sold! He was very happy with its condition and the bits I had on it, so off it has gone to a new owner to enjoy being ridden!