Electric Boogaloo

[Matt]

I'm in New Zealand at the moment (humbrol brog) and just picked up a Kia Niro 2 eV to get me around.
From what I've found out so far it's got a motor out front making roughly 200hp, and a 64 something battery that claimed (the car, not the BS marketing material wltp stuff) just over 400km of range. So 240 miles.

I've driven 200km today and the range is 200km less than this morning.

It's quite a nice car for these roads. The power is enough at the NZ "speed kills" low limits everywhere, and it accelerates like you're always in the right gear. Ride comfort is pretty good too, but I didn't bring my e class to compare.

Downsides are probably standard for all new cars. It tries to flipping steer round corners. The annoying thing about this is it's lacking an idea or ability to measure sight lines, so it wants to hug the inside line round bends. It also gets stressed and vibrates the wheel when I change lane, or overtake, or when there's a merge in turn. These happen a lot here as some kind of aid for people joining a main road by turning right.

The auto steering is alright on the motorway though. Add radar cruise and it's a good combo. Though I'm sure everyone following is seeing the car weave from side to side expecting death and destruction.

Anyway. Who's driven or is owning am eV?

Obviously the main thing once all normo stuff is done is charging. I spent 2gbp this morning as I visited that Scottish museum place but the git charger stopped at 80% so it was hardly worth it. Tomorrow I need to leave it in town for a while on a measly 50kw charger otherwise I won't make it to John o groates equivalent. And up here you get one or two chargers and that's it.

And everyone lived happily ever after. Also, Europcar say most of their fleet here is eV now.

[farmer]

that steering thing is horrible. new defender has it and it's not made for narrow country roads.... it will definitely keep you alert, but not in a nice way. landrover in their wisdom haven't left an "off" option. you can switch it off but when you stop and start the car again it's back on by default.
you don't remember this until it gives you another horror moment jerking the car towards the other side of the road as it thinks the hedge, trees..whatever is too close. it is unnerving to say the least.
i used all my computer training and tech savy to look up where the cameras where at and put insulating tape over them...problem solved. i'm thinking of selling this "fix" to landrover so don't tell them. 

[richtea]

Very nice. Now I am jealous. Of NZ, not Kia, or whatever the car thing was.

If you want to get eNerdy, take Sam out for a drink/meal:
https://www.youtube.com/@NewZeroland/featured

[Phmode]

So, this Kia thing and the Deaf-end-er does the steering for you? Is that even a thing? How does it know where you want to go? What if you change your mind?

I must have had a senior moment and misunderstood...

So do you still steer and wtf is the vibration for.

And in the case of the LR, what the hefll does it do in a field or a farmyard or up a mountain?

[Matt]

Well the be frank, Margaret, I'm not entirely clued up yet. The Niro at least, has a seemingly always on function that lights an icon when it detects you're in a lane, be it a motorway or a single carriageway. I'm guessing it's looking for white or yellow broken or solid lines.

Without pressing anything if it senses, I dunno, a pretty turny turn, it seems to try and get you going round it. And also if you go over a line it vibrates the wheel and probably makes noise.

Now, I've only tried this on the motorway so far, but if I press some button on the steering wheel I get an extra icon and it steers itself. I've not tried this on a non motorway. It's just keeping between the lines, but it doesn't feel very nice as it drifts in the lane, constantly over correcting, like a drunk driver. None of this will do lane changes or manoeuvres.

Then we have radar cruise. If I enable both i suppose it does help on long journeys. Nicer here though where there is less traffic.

And that's it. I don't know the sensor suite and I'd like to try a current revision Tesla to see if it betters it on this.

[Matt]

Update: OK a long press on the auto steering button turned the whole thing off. Just as well as the road up to Cape Reinga turned into a proper fun road. No traffic either apart from an eager German lad who couldn't manage the same overtakes in the hire suzuki hybrid thing he had. It amused me that other than locals the second fastest tourist was a German chap .

Charging hadn't been too bad either. It's a 64kilobadger battery but I think very efficient, so even these 50kw chargers get me 30 percent in about 30 minutes, which is alright here as taking a break is a good thing. In tourist season proper it might get iffy if there are queues.

In UK I think many are 150kw so less problematic, or perhaps then the limitation is the car. I'm not sure the mac charge speed thingy this can take.

Update ends. Odometer just went over 1k miles. Still has the nice transparent plastic covers over half the dash.

[Phmode]

OK. Some of that makes sense.

So does it self-steer on normal wibbly roads? How would it do on the road past my place for instance?

Apart from the obvious, unasked question of 'why?' One wonders who?

Does it do overtakes? Does it do nearsides and offsides? Who started this thing?

But anyway, was NZ worth two days of your life in a bean tin to get there and back?

[Belco100]

Not sure if I have got my head around this, but when I was looking for an electric car I was under the impression that they were cheap to run?

But if I do a run to the NEC for the bike show, it is around 300 miles round trip on Motorways:

• My Diesel Car - 45mpg, approx £7.25 per Gallon = £48.50
• The Electric Car I was looking at - 3.1miles per kW, 65p per kW = £62.90

So Diesel even with 60% tax added on it is still cheaper for a journey? I know if I spend £1,000 and put a charger in at home it is a lot cheaper which is OK if you always use it, but it's not cheap when you are out and about and when the Gov decide they need to start getting their tax back on electric vehicles (probably road pricing) it will be even worse 

[black-k1]

Electric was the cheaper option until Putin decided he wanted to holiday in the Ukraine.

[chriscanning]

Keep the posts coming cuz it’s been a topic of conversation in the house of recent living on the side of the M6 like we do and it’s normally our first option when travelling anywhere the increase in the number of electric cars and vans we see on it must be up by 30/40 percent at the very least, ranging from the very trick looking MG’sto the endless number of Tesla’s

The biggest problem as I see it is just the lack of willingness to adapt,and the best example I can up with how many of you give run a lithium battery on your bikes,got to the point of not mentioning such on forums cuz bikers are so ingrained with lead acid,bought my first one must 6 years and still going strong and currently run my old 1100s/Tiger 955/K1200r Sport/KTM GT/1050 SpeedTriple/XR1000  bought a new charger and had to buy a new RR for the Tiger cuz the early Triumphs didn’t like it apart from that it’s been happy days and when doing a charge on them all in garage yesterday most needed less than 30 minutes despite lack of use.

[richtea]

The biggest problem as I see it is just the lack of willingness to adapt...

More like a lack of willingness to commit a chunk of cash until the price becomes normalised.

I'd say they're getting pretty close though. 150-200 mile range used compact cars are now in the £8-12k range, for something not too ancient. I'd consider that's reasonable for a local runabout - as in 80% of trips, and keep a diesel chugger for the long distance trips.

I'm just waiting for diesel chugger No 2 to die, but it insists on being reliable. Another year or two, and we'll be there.

As for electric motorbikes - they're not doing as well as I expected. The prices are stubbornly high, and so sales are stubbornly low, with only Energica making what I'd call a usable bike (distance, fast charge, performance, quality). But £20k secondhand. Ouch.

[chriscanning]

Start of Covid had to come up with a plan,our holidays would start mid year after we had ridden to Le-Mans for the bike 24 hour mid April come home and a month later NW200 and think about what ever back in Europe for our real hols.

Decided we would swap manual mountain bikes for electric versions,talk about a learning curve both financial and technical I’d be typing all night to cover what has gone on and hence my reluctance,

[Matt]

Not sure if I have got my head around this, but when I was looking for an electric car I was under the impression that they were cheap to run?

But if I do a run to the NEC for the bike show, it is around 300 miles round trip on Motorways:

• My Diesel Car - 45mpg, approx £7.25 per Gallon = £48.50
• The Electric Car I was looking at - 3.1miles per kW, 65p per kW = £62.90

So Diesel even with 60% tax added on it is still cheaper for a journey? I know if I spend £1,000 and put a charger in at home it is a lot cheaper which is OK if you always use it, but it's not cheap when you are out and about and when the Gov decide they need to start getting their tax back on electric vehicles (probably road pricing) it will be even worse 

For sure public chargers are spendy. Out here they're 0.8NZD per kw-budgie or wtf. So that about 40gbp pence a kw. The real saving (ignoring buying an old Tesla Model S/X and getting free supercharging) is charging at home where it's... whatever our rates are now. They used to be 12p before everything went to crap. Ok, 28.85p per kwh for my electricity at home. I'm getting it charged for free at this hotel.

This thing is getting 4.1 miles per kwh over these last few days. 4.4 for the day I was on motorways most of the day. But that is very efficient, i'm quite surprised as whatever reading I previously did told me 3 was decent. But then I am on open roads, almost no traffic - so no stop start action - and occasional overtakes. I imagine my average speed is quite high, but I never go over 65-70mph, mostly sat at 60.

Anyway yeah, home charge means about 25 quid for the 300 mile trip, and if you need public for the extra distance, it's getting subsidised by however often you fill up at home. i.e our annual diesel cost per mile is averaged out over the cost of diesel at every fill. So if most fills of electricity are at home then the weighted cost is towards the 29p end of the scale.

Or something. Anyway, this place doesn't have an eV charging station but just an outdoor plug. So it'll be on the slow slow tonight, and hopefully tomorrow will be full.

[Matt]

OK. Some of that makes sense.

So does it self-steer on normal wibbly roads? How would it do on the road past my place for instance?

Apart from the obvious, unasked question of 'why?' One wonders who?

Does it do overtakes? Does it do nearsides and offsides? Who started this thing?

But anyway, was NZ worth two days of your life in a bean tin to get there and back?

Sorry Bri, answering your pieces:
1. Does it steer on wibbly roads? It tries to if it thinks one is going to not steer in time. But as I say, it doesn't respect efforts to take sight lines into account let alone straight lining stuff. It has no context. I'd say it sees a line getting close and steers away. Until it gets close to the next line. That's default behaviour. If you turn on auto steer it ups its game to assuming you won't steer. I think.

2. How do on my road? It needs lines to stick between. I also don't know what the manual says. I'd only want to use auto steer on motorways. Let's call the lower down default intervention "safety steer". If it can't see any lines it does nothing.

3. Why and who. I don't know who. It seems too inconsistent to say "sure, anyone who's just going A to B and doesn't enjoy driving". One moment it'll try and "rescue" you and the next it'll do nothing. If you've been eagle eyed on the dash you'll notice the little green lane steering icon go off but if you've been watching the road or your phone, it'll be a surprise. Ie I don't trust it. The why could be answered if it evolves to a consistent experience. But as the environment isn't consistent I don't see it ever getting there. The exception being cars with intelligent vision, but then even Tesla took cameras off the 3 because they disagreed with the radar. Brill.

4. Does it do overtakes? Nope. I think a Tesla with some top level option does. This one just has less of a fit if I indicate before changing lanes. Let's say I'm on a motorway and on full auto steer. And radar cruise. Relaxed grip on steering wheel, letting it do it. And the guy in front is slowing, and the next lane is empty. I'll indicate right, move into that lane with maybe a brief vibrating steering wheel feeling. I'll not have touched any pedals though either. Then I'll relax steering wheel grip again and it'll return to target speed until an obstacle/car appears.

5. Who's fault? Bob Hoskins. Nearside offside not sure what maneuver we talking aboot

6. Was it worth it? Yes! I got to see my friend, and I've been getting to appreciate how a country with single digit millions works. Today I walked to a beach and didn't see another human. A deserted beach. Standard here. I'm heading back to the city in a couple of days and will spend a bit of time in Auckland proper, given that's where the work is. Although even then the nearest beach is 45 minutes, and most of that is through forest. Even up here (Google Karikari peninsula) it isn't that far. I've not found anything terrible or that would make me unhappy to live here for the next 6 months. Yet. Hurrah for British pessimism!

[chriscanning]

The important part of this thread,the car is rented!!!! from my experience of all things electric legally used in the UK I would be looking to do the same sure as hell wouldn’t buy one,not yet anyway.